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On Eating Meat

By: Starfoxy

A woman in my ward recently posted a request for recipes on her personal blog. This woman is an avid cook, and already has more recipes than most. The reason she put out this request was because she had decided to take a more active role in reducing the amount of meat in her diet. One reason she cited was the phrase from D&C 89 that says to eat meat sparingly.

She never said that she was attempting vegetarianism, let alone veganism. All she said was that she wanted to reduce the amount of meat in her diet, and so wanted more recipes that had little to meat in them.  This declaration didn't seem at all unusual to me, and is even something I have considered doing myself. I was taken aback when the first comment on her post expressed deep concern about my friend's motivations for doing something so drastic. A later post intimated other friends and family members had expressed similar sentiments to my friend in person.

Now, I can think of several reasons why a reduced meat diet is a good idea. First, as I mentioned earlier, there is the notion that we should eat meat sparingly. I personally feel that eating meat with every meal (or even nearly every meal) doesn't count as 'sparingly.' I also think that building your meals and diet around meat is not strictly compatible with the idea of eating meat sparingly.

Another good reason to reduce the amount of meat is for budgetary reasons. Meat is expensive. Unless you are eating the very cheapest, 'near meat' products, reducing the meat in your diet will probably cost you less money. Even something as simple as reducing the serving size can be incredibly effective. A serving of steak is supposed to be about the size of a deck of cards. Every steak I've ever eaten has been at least three times that size. With that mindset one 'steak' can serve me, my husband and my toddler.

Expense is also where the idea of building your diet around meat comes into play. When one is used to constructing a meal around a meat product it can be difficult to figure out what to eat when meat is removed from the meal. Many people resort to buying expensive replacement meats, such as veggie burgers and tofurky. Shifting focus away from meat counteracts this trend.

Another reason is the humanitarian/environmental reasons. The way most meat is produced is not environmentally sound, nor humane for the animals. I grew up around animals that would be killed for eating, so I'm not too bothered by the idea of killing and eating that adorable little chicken, cow, pig, or whatever.  However, because I grew up with animals that would be killed for eating I understand that, while that chicken's days may be numbered, it deserves clean humane conditions while it is alive. Also, most factory farms abuse antibiotics, and are major polluters. It isn't a industrial model I feel good about supporting. So the meat I do feel good about buying, tends to be the most expensive, which provides further benefit for reducing the amount I eat.

The best argument against a meat-free diet is the nutrition angle. Meat is one of the best sources of protein out there. And, if I understand correctly, it is extremely difficult to get all of the different types of protiens humans need from vegetables alone. By that same token nutrition is another great argument for a reduced meat diet. Meat is high in fat and cholesterol. Using meat as a supplementary source of protein, rather than a primary source of protein is, by all accounts, just plain better for you.

With all of these reasons, I have a really hard time believing that a reduced meat diet is anywhere close to 'extreme.' (It is certainly much less extreme than the Atkins diet, for one.)  I will concede that veganism is extreme (and should not be undertaken lightly), and vegetarianism can be borderline extreme (depending on how strict, and how severe one chooses to be).  But I can't see a reduced meat diet as anything other than a reasonable dietary option. So I find myself struggling to understand where my friend's concerned acquaintances are coming from.

Print | posted on Wednesday, January 23, 2008 5:57 PM | Filed Under [ Starfoxy ]

Comments:

#1: colleen

due to the dominant North American LDS culture coming from western pioneer stock, i'm not terribly surprised that a minimal-meat diet is met with suspicion and disapproval. we're talking about a long history of western cattle & sheep ranching. i have drastically reduced the amount of meat we eat in our household and we have meat-free days several times a week. this has been easier for my kids, who are still in their formative years, than it has been for my poor husband - he agrees with me in theory, but in practice cannot always bring himself to eat some meat substitutions. i suppose the fact that i live in southern california accounts for nobody expressing any disapproval of our minimal-meat lifestyle. nobody much liked my vegetarian chili at our ward chili cook-off, although i admit i have made MUCH better chili at other times. ;) i have occasionally thought about writing a WoW cookbook, but don't have my act together enough.

like many other north americans, we LDS have an obesity problem. undoubtedly our love of meat is a contributing factor. i would love to see this addressed by church leadership in some way, but i know that dietary health probably ranks low on the salvation meter.
1/23/2008 8:33 PM

#2: Michelle

I completely agree with what you're saying. We, too, have tried to reduce the amount of meat we eat, for all the reasons you mentioned. My biggest challenge is just getting out of the mindset you mentioned, where everything is constructed around the meat dish. Coming up with meatless meals that are well-balanced, not too complicated, and satisfying to everyone isn't easy for me.
1/23/2008 9:21 PM

#3: m&m

Sounds to me like knee-jerk responses from people who have seen those who have gone to extremes, which appears to be a completely unnecessary response given this situation. They probably misunderstood what she meant to do.

Either that, or perhaps they felt pricked because they are eating too much meat and decided to attack her rather than look inward. :)
1/23/2008 10:07 PM

#4: Eric Nielson

This is an interesting aspect of our WofW culture in the church. I would have guessed that it would have been more likely for Mormons to become borderline vegetarians than for Mormons to become caffiene abstainers based on section 89 of the D&C.

I have sometimes wondered if the eating meat sparingly was partly due to lack of refrigeration, and that it is appropriately less of an issue in modern times. Hard to say.
1/24/2008 6:32 AM

#5: ECS

And, if I understand correctly, it is extremely difficult to get all of the different types of protiens humans need from vegetables alone.


Are you including eggs and dairy in your definition of "meat"? Eggs and dairy provide the same protein as meat. If you eat eggs and dairy, it's easy to get all the nutritious protein you need.

I'm not sure why people think vegetarian and vegan lifestyles are "extreme". Why is it extreme to choose to not eat meat because you care about your health and the environment? On the other hand, subsisting on Big Macs and Coke is "extreme". At least these foods will make you "extremely" unhealthy :)
1/24/2008 7:32 AM

#6: Starfoxy

I forgot one other point. The food storage angle. Canned meat just doesn't taste good to me. If I ever plan on being able to live off of my food storage I've got to get used to eating very very little meat because I'd rather not eat any than eat canned meat. *shudder*

M&M- I suspect your idea about feeling pricked is more common than one might think. I've read several vegetarians describe their experience that a simple admission of being a vegetarian invokes defensive, sometimes virulent responses in others.

ECS- I remember a few months ago a story came out where a couple had basically starved their baby to death, and were on trial for negligent homicide. The couple's explanation was that they were vegans, (I personally think that was an after-the-fact rationalization). I think stories like that one tend to paint what veganism is in the eyes of people who don't have personal experience.

I tend to think that veganism is extreme only because of the current social/dietary environment. Animal byproducts are *everywhere* and avoiding them requires a huge time commitment. The amount of research, education, time spent shopping, cooking, etc is well outside what most people are willing to do. I don't find it extreme in a moral sense, but rather a practical application sense. I personally find people who take it seriously rather impressive, and admire their commitment to their ideals.
1/24/2008 9:43 AM

#7: Kurt

And, if I understand correctly, it is extremely difficult to get all of the different types of protiens humans need from vegetables alone


Dairy and eggs notwithstanding, it is not "extremely difficult" to get all of the proteins humans need without eating something animal-derived. That is a common misconception. A staple diet of beans and rice will get you complete proteins.

In the interest of self-disclosure, I am a vegetarian, have been for a long, long time. I do eat eggs and dairy. But, that is more out of laziness and self-indulgence than anything else, not because of health concerns over lack of protein in my diet.

The real difficulty in vegetarianism is when you lean toward vegan and want to avoid all animal products, it excludes the massive majority of consumer food products. It creates a lot more work, having to eschew all sorts of things we would take for granted.

In addition to the reasons cited above for vegetarianism, one of the big reasons I adopted it was because of my experience in food service. Through high school and college I worked in a lot of food service and the simple fact is meat never goes into the trash, it always goes out onto someones plate, no matter what. Its just too expensive to throw away. I saw so much stuff first-hand that, over-time, just ended up turning me against meat. Anyone who has worked in the food service industry will have kitchen horror stories.
1/24/2008 9:46 AM

#8: Tanya

This is a very difficult topic for me. You see, as someone that suffers from obesity, AND infertility problems, my health did not improve UNTIL I increased the MEAT and FATS in my diet. I had a very spiritual experience with the study of the WoW when I was considering starting a low carb plan. Trust me, I thought it must be wrong, but the reality was my body thought and still thinks that it is in a case of starvation. Due to this response I need the meat, and the protein to undo the damage I have done to my body. Not only did I loose weight, but I also have conceived two beautiful daughters that I never expected to be blessed with. My health problems changed drastically.
People seem to think that to eat low carb we are gorging ourselves with meat. I found for me, when I started with in two weeks I was down to consuming less meat than I started with, and because I was eating adequate fats and proteins all cravings were gone. Including the refined sugar cravings which is worse in my mind than the consumption of meats and fats.
I know we can debate the merits of how we eat, and few will agree with me. The point I want to emphasize is that I know I was lead to this plan for me by my loving Heavenly Father. I came to understand that sparingly meant "with Gratitude" for the life of the animal. I think that puts a completely different spin on what "Sparingly means".
I can honestly say that it is more important to pray and study the matter because what is right for one person may not be right for another. I have had many people, included extended family say that I was breaking the WoW by following a lowcarb diet, but I have to tell you if anyone saw what I was eating they would have thought I was eating extremely well. The problems would come when I would say I was lowcarb. They would not look at the beautiful salad on my plate, the lack of sugars and starch, the healthy oils, and a nice peice of fish or meat.
I think the WoW has more to do with balance than anything. If someone is perfectly healthy, perfect weight, they can eat differently, than someone who's body is out of balance. I think then, we need to do a bit of adjusting to get it back to balance, and then slowly adjust the diet back to what would be normal and healthy for the body and its weight.
1/24/2008 11:26 AM

#9: colleen

tanya, if this is the case for you then so be it. there are always exceptions and we must all certainly inherit different metabolisms depending on our genetic backgrounds. and "low carb" can certainly include a wide variety of healthy fruits and vegetables. it doesn't have to mean "all meat all the time." but most people i know who eat a meat-intense diet are not balancing - ham & eggs for breakfast with no fruit, cooking the green beans with bacon, etc. my aside comment above was not intended to hurt. meat is not the only culprit in our obesity epidemic, but indiscriminate eating of fatty meats is a factor.

it comes down to labels and the meanings we attach to those labels. "vegan" to some people means strident, hemp-wearing anarchists. "vegetarian" means holier-than-thou moralizers. "low carb" means cheeseburgers every night. it's knee-jerk stuff.
1/24/2008 11:35 AM

#10: Dom

we LDS have an obesity problem. undoubtedly our love of meat is a contributing factor


Hate to say it but the contributing factor isn't really covered in the Word of Wisdom straight out. Meat is not the problem. It can be a problem if you are eating meat for every meal, but meat doesn't actually lead to obesity. Other internal problems yes, but not obesity.

Super processed foods is the problem and super processed foods aren't covered in the WoW unless you cook your own food by the WoW's guidelines. If you go to the store and buy processed foods based on the WoW your still getting crap in your diet like High Fructose Corn Syrup which is cheaper then sugar but far more unhealthy. HFCS is just one of the many *newer* ingredients found in foods that the WoW doesn't cover because they didn't exist so are considered okay.

Of meats: White meat is good, red meat not so good.
Of cooking: Baked is good, steamed/boiled is good, pan fried not as good, deep fried (french fries) is the worst (again imo).

Cooking meathods also aren't covered in the WoW. Course in 1830 frontier everything was raw, baked, boiled or pan fried. Take a potato for example. Bake it and it's pretty good. Keep the skin on because that's where most of the vitamins are. Cut it up and deep fat fry it and it's no longer a potato. Instead it's fryer fat and left over potato starch with salt on it.

Get rid of processed foods from the store and make stuff from scratch and you go a LONG way towards combating health problems. The WoW in writing, interpretation, nor in enforcement unfortunately didn't or doesn't make any distinction between healthy scratch food and unhealthy super processed foods that otherwise seem the same.

My wife is Type-II diabetic. Without exercise we have removed processed foods from our diet and only each fresh vegetables, and fresh (frozen) meats. If we can't pronounce or know what ingredients are in foods we buy processed we don't eat them. Some Lean Cuisines(tm) are good and use vinegar and salt as their preservatives, others are bad and use crap. That's just one brand. You really gotta look or just cook your own and freeze.

After less then a year my wife is no longer considered Type-II diabetic and her A1C is completely normal.

Not only the diabetes but she no longer gets sick at least once a month, sleeps much better, isn't as emotional, stopped snoring and she doesn't grind her teeth anymore when she sleeps. There's more but that's just off the top of my head. All that just from removing processed foods from our diet.

Now she just needs to exercise when the weather gets warm :).

Super processed foods that we are used to in the United States will cause more health problems and kill you faster then caffeine will. I'm not saying that the WoW is wrong, I'm just saying that it doesn't cover many of the things that are actually causing problems now. Maybe it is time for the church leaders to pray for an updated WoW. Without it I fear members will continue to stuff their faces full of food that is much worse for them thinking they are okay.

Sorry for the long rambling post.
1/24/2008 12:01 PM

#11: John

Meat just TASTES good. For me, that's the problem.
1/24/2008 12:06 PM

#12: Tanya

All I am saying is that often I have been judged at being extreme, when I say lowcarb, not at what is on my plate. I find people judge those of us that need to lowcarb because our bodies can't handle the insulin needs that starchy foods bring. As I said, I prayed about it, and pondered and studied it. There are many problems with our diets today and Meat is not the culprit, I don't even think red meat is the villian that many people say it is.
As mentioned there are many more things that contribute to poor health and I don't think it is all the food God has blessed us with, but what man makes to "copy" those foods.
I believe that the Wow should be a personal discussion with Heavenly Father for each person and in the process those needs may change.
Just don't judge someone that is eating all meat as breaking the WoW because that maybe what they need to do for their body to accept that it is not starving for nutrients. It may be what they need to do to keep insulin levels down so they don't put on fat, and insulin is the hormone that stores fat in the body, the only thing that triggers insulin is carbohydrates. Talk to those people, you may find that they know the science behind what they are doing, why it will work for them. Granted most people do not do that, and just do it without understanding why.
All I know for me the following went away, that were terrible problems for me when I followed the traditional thinking of the WoW.
1. Irritable Bowel, bothered me nearly daily, gone
2. Heartburn/reflux Gone
3. Symptoms of premenopause Gone
4. Infertility/anovulatory gone
5. Precancerous condition gone
6 oily skin turned normal
7. energy increase

Dom, how you are eating is similar to the program I followed, The Schwarzbien Principle by Dr. Diana Schwarbien. She advocates eating balanced meals, protein, fats, non starchy vegetables and a small amount of starch in every meal. Bread was avoided, all preservatives, chemicals, man made materials was a no go. :)
1/24/2008 5:04 PM

#13: bfwebster

Some decades back, when my (former) wife and I were very much 'Mother Earth News' types (and, yes, we subscribed for years), I made heavy use of the book Diet for a Small Planet by Frances Moore Lappe. The book did a good job of talking about combined foods (e.g., rice and beans) to achieve the necessary amino acids to replace meats and had lots of useful recipes. It looks as though the current edition has been updated from the one I used 30 or so years ago, and that Lappe was written a sequel as well. FWIW. ..bruce..

1/31/2008 8:01 PM

#14: Tristi Pinkston

Great comments, everyone.

Tanya, you are definitely right that our bodies are all different. I do best on a medium amount of meat -- I have a tendency toward anemia, and the meat helps stabilize my iron better than anything else. I can also feel it when I've had too much. If we all went about our dietary needs in a thoughtful, introspective manner, I think we'd all do better, feel healthier, and weigh less, if that's what our bodies needed.

The main point to the original post holds true throughout all the comments. It's up to us to decide how to eat and it's up to everyone else to allow us that freedom. We're all stewards over our own bodies,and we will either be blessed or chastened for those choices, but it's an individual thing. What I eat won't be right for everyone because my body is different.

My mom's husband was European and he was shot in the stomach during WWII. The only liquid he could drink without horrendous pain was coffee. So he drank coffee. I don't think he'll be "in trouble" for that -- it was either that or dehydrate.
2/3/2008 2:50 PM

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